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Post by Spiegs on Feb 18, 2014 16:59:40 GMT
We've all read the io9 piece by now, about Robert W. Chambers, Carcosa, and the Yellow King. Someone hipped me to the fact that "Hart" and Rust" combine to form "Hastur." (when letters are not repeated). Hastur is "the unspeakable one," an entity so evil he is not to be named. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HasturHe appears in the work of Chambers, and H.P. Lovecraft. Pizolatto, the former lit professor, is tying decades old writings on horror and evil together. I think the whole series, and the "flat circle" of time, refers to this literary universe...as writers continue to be fascinated by the evil within all of us. Are we the detective as we watch? Is Rust the detective who gets it all, and is searching on a higher plane? We'll see this story again....see evil again...in the next book, movie, or show. |
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Post by Admin on Feb 18, 2014 17:10:40 GMT
Right on
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Post by julied on Feb 18, 2014 19:18:57 GMT
That makes my brain hurt.
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Post by artsmarshall on Feb 19, 2014 0:52:47 GMT
That's where I got to earlier, Spiegs. I started researching all of the tattoos on the characters and realized every one meant something that was relevant to the story. Then went back to the first episode to see other details. 10 minutes in, there were way too many. Looking at color, geometry, symbolism (spirals/mandalas) and by then there was already an immense amount of info to piece together. Thinking back to college fiction writing classes, the story map is enormous, same way detectives map out evidence on boards with photos, docs, and string. Not expecting this show to end with a deliberate conclusion, but more than enough evidence to solve the mystery. It would be a hell of an undertaking to storyboard this, but I feel that is the point.
It's in essence breaking down the forth wall in a postmodern art sense. The flat circle is a metaphor for the series itself. We know there are all new characters next season, so... 1) story concept from the artist conceived. 2) story is in a ton of pieces on a storyboard. 3) story plays out. 2) story is pieced together by the viewer( detective). 1) story is conceived as the artist conceived it. Next season. Repeat.
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The Fatherhood Burden
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Post by The Fatherhood Burden on Feb 20, 2014 18:16:15 GMT
I can't stop thinking about "The King in Yellow" and exactly how it applies to this show. The original book was a series of 10 short stories, the first four of which the "The King in Yellow" is germane to the central theme. Specifically, "The King in Yellow" was a play, that after reading would drive you insane. The first story in the book is called "The Repairer of Reputations". Take a look at this brief description from wikipedia, and marvel at all of the parallels between characters in this story and TD. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Repairer_of_ReputationsSo if this is the basis upon which TD character development was spawned, you could potentially believe that Season 2 will be another story from the book, and "The King in Yellow" will still be prominent. If that's the case, I surmise that "The Yellow King" is not actually a character at all in this series, but instead represents the void at the center of the time spiral referred to as a "flat circle". One of the more intriguing aspects of this story is the fact that throughout reading you get a false narrative from the lead character, and the falsehood of events is only revealed at the end... |
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Post by sangamo on Feb 20, 2014 21:01:30 GMT
The characters are almost certainly referring to the literary work we viewers now are aware of mostly because of our access to the internet. Marty and Rust would not have had that resource in the 90s. Even in 2002, the amount of reference material on the web would not have been broad enough to encompass that literary work.
However, by 2010, Rust would have been able to google it and may have found enough about it to help break the case or at least put him on the track.
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Post by Admin on Feb 21, 2014 0:26:38 GMT
Good call.
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Post by artsmarshall on Feb 21, 2014 8:40:50 GMT
Yes. Exactly.
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Post by artsmarshall on Feb 21, 2014 10:13:18 GMT
On this level, there are a few concepts at play. Barthes Death of an author is the predominate, but also the everyone is a critic idea that Dave Hickey and Lane Relyea has written about. These concepts are the maddening ones that the yellow king book eludes to. Also see Antoine Artaud as the crux of the idea.
The spiral comes into play on another level since philosophy is at essence a spiral. The spiral being the insanity that the play aforementioned.
I have a hunch that Hume is at play as well as the referenced nietzsche. Still looking into that though.
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Post by artsmarshall on Feb 21, 2014 10:27:36 GMT
To footnote. Relyea and Hickey talk about the fact that there is no true voice in the modern era since "Everyone is a Critic". Amazon, Netflix, eBay, etc. No one has the authoritative voice as it once existed. But it cannot be denied that there is an underlying narrative. It's just that there are too many narratives that are created and the objective if a critic, to build constituents, can't exist like it always has in the present era.
Playing off that postmodern concept is maddening since there is no real truth by default of the times. There wouldn't be a handful of philosophers if this concept always was. We won't be reading about all of the 3 million amazon reviewers in 50 years because an authoritative voice can't exist.
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Post by artsmarshall on Feb 21, 2014 10:29:24 GMT
Is hockey on yet?
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Post by sangamo on Feb 21, 2014 17:42:46 GMT
The advent of Google broke a mystery for me personally. Family secrets that my ancestors thought they took to their graves were revealed by documents left in archives that were cataloged and published on the web.
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The Fatherhood Burden
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Post by The Fatherhood Burden on Feb 21, 2014 18:00:33 GMT
By referencing "The Yellow King", I'm not alluding to Rust and Hart figuring out the case based on those clues, I'm alluding to the fact that Pizzalato had this character blueprint in mind when writing the show.
In "The Repairer or Reputations", the main character Hildred is insane, following a fall from a horse. Rust is quite potentially insane, or was at one point, based on his heavy drug use while undercover, and his stint at a mental institution following that period. Hildred becomes obsessed with the Yellow King after reading the play, and leads the reader through a false narrative, just as we question whether Cohle's story is truthful.
With this character theory, I haven't quite mapped out with certainty which of the other characters would correlate with characters in True Detective, but I have my guesses.
Marty Hart could be Hildred. Perhaps he's the insane one and his narrative is the unreliable one. He could also be Louis, the man that a delusional Hildred sees standing in the way of his path to the Yellow King's throne. He could be Hawberk, given the sudden attention towards his oldest daughter.
Mr. Wilde (The Repairer of Reputations), is a scandalous opportunist, but also very powerful. This leads me to think Theriot or Tuttle. Since we know Theriot dies in 2010, you could argue that his fate parallels Mr. Wilde's.
Reginal LeDoux could be Louis, the perceived heir.
It's a loose character association, and this story doesn't need to follow the Chamber's story exactly, but the coincidences are just way too cool.
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Post by sangamo on Feb 21, 2014 22:08:12 GMT
So, in your interpretation the Chambers story doesn't necessarily even exist within the True Detective world; it's just a character template perhaps, or an abstract Easter egg. Fair enough. I'm reading Chambers now but I'm not finding anything analogous between the two stories.
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